. XIII
2nd February 2008, 12:25 PM
Well, if Western Europe was only made out of England and Switzerland, your
comment would be correct. In his deranged view, English were just a notch
below the "aryan race". Rudolf Hess made a good try to separate England from
the rest of the continent. But the rest of the continent there is.
Hitler stated in his book what fate he had in mind for France, which he
considered his main hindrance for his eastward expansion. As most of the
German military strategy in Western Europe involved lowlands (both Belgium
and Netherland), those two countries were incvluded in the same fate, almost
by default. Those countries are making a good chunk of Europe.
And we're talking only about western Europe here, not taknig into account
Czechkoslovakia (sp), or Yugoslavia.
So no, I stand by my view. Hitler aim was indeed an eastward expansion but
he had first to close account in the west so nothing would hinder his
progress. Saying otherwise or saying he had little interest in the west is a
misunderstatement.
Didier,
From: Gavin Wynford-Jones <gavinwj@...>
Reply-To: mepbmlist (AT) yahoogroups (DOT) com
To: mepbmlist (AT) yahoogroups (DOT) com
Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] OT: Loss of diplomacy
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 11:57:42 +0200
Not wrong at all. MK can be seen as mainly being the venting of a lot
of frustration. Hitler himself had abandoned a lot of its principles
by 1938. Austria was supposed to be an associated state, run by
Austrian Nazis, but that also got messed up. Peter Fleming's book,
"Invasion 1940", written in the mid 50s and based on German and
British documentation, clearly shows that he wasn't actually very
interested in invading England, so it's a good bet Switzerland wasn't
high on his list either.
Gavin
On 29 Sep 2005, at 09:03, . XIII wrote:
> It's a very safe bet to say this is totally wrong, not that I would
> advise
> reading "mein kampf".
>
> I'd recommend reading "Rise and fall of the Third reich" by
> Williams Shirer
> to any party interested.
>
> And yes, diplomatically, it's always interesting to leave a back
> door open,
> cf Austria during the cold war.
>
> Didier
>
>
> From: Gavin Wynford-Jones <gavinwj@...>
> Reply-To: mepbmlist (AT) yahoogroups (DOT) com
> To: mepbmlist (AT) yahoogroups (DOT) com
> Subject: [mepbmlist] OT: Loss of diplomacy
> Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 06:13:48 +0200
>
> Given what I've read on the subjective, the answer is "quite likely".
> I'm currently reading AJP Taylor's book about the origins of the war
> and it's quite revealing about how little of western Europe Hitler
> was actually interested in. His target was Soviet Russia. He also
> didn't want Italy as an ally, but thanks to some messed up diplomacy
> by the other powers, that's what he got...
>
> ME may only be a game, but one of its founding precepts is neutrals.
> The word neutral carries significant connotations. Maybe they should
> be called "unaligned" instead.
>
> Gavin
>
> On 29 Sep 2005, at 03:10, Steve wrote:
>
>
>> Had Hitler prevailed do you really think he would left a Switzerland
>> alone while he owned most of Europe because he liked them? I
>> don't know why Switzerland was left alone though I do believe
>> that many German officers used it to house what they looted.
>>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
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comment would be correct. In his deranged view, English were just a notch
below the "aryan race". Rudolf Hess made a good try to separate England from
the rest of the continent. But the rest of the continent there is.
Hitler stated in his book what fate he had in mind for France, which he
considered his main hindrance for his eastward expansion. As most of the
German military strategy in Western Europe involved lowlands (both Belgium
and Netherland), those two countries were incvluded in the same fate, almost
by default. Those countries are making a good chunk of Europe.
And we're talking only about western Europe here, not taknig into account
Czechkoslovakia (sp), or Yugoslavia.
So no, I stand by my view. Hitler aim was indeed an eastward expansion but
he had first to close account in the west so nothing would hinder his
progress. Saying otherwise or saying he had little interest in the west is a
misunderstatement.
Didier,
From: Gavin Wynford-Jones <gavinwj@...>
Reply-To: mepbmlist (AT) yahoogroups (DOT) com
To: mepbmlist (AT) yahoogroups (DOT) com
Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] OT: Loss of diplomacy
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 11:57:42 +0200
Not wrong at all. MK can be seen as mainly being the venting of a lot
of frustration. Hitler himself had abandoned a lot of its principles
by 1938. Austria was supposed to be an associated state, run by
Austrian Nazis, but that also got messed up. Peter Fleming's book,
"Invasion 1940", written in the mid 50s and based on German and
British documentation, clearly shows that he wasn't actually very
interested in invading England, so it's a good bet Switzerland wasn't
high on his list either.
Gavin
On 29 Sep 2005, at 09:03, . XIII wrote:
> It's a very safe bet to say this is totally wrong, not that I would
> advise
> reading "mein kampf".
>
> I'd recommend reading "Rise and fall of the Third reich" by
> Williams Shirer
> to any party interested.
>
> And yes, diplomatically, it's always interesting to leave a back
> door open,
> cf Austria during the cold war.
>
> Didier
>
>
> From: Gavin Wynford-Jones <gavinwj@...>
> Reply-To: mepbmlist (AT) yahoogroups (DOT) com
> To: mepbmlist (AT) yahoogroups (DOT) com
> Subject: [mepbmlist] OT: Loss of diplomacy
> Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 06:13:48 +0200
>
> Given what I've read on the subjective, the answer is "quite likely".
> I'm currently reading AJP Taylor's book about the origins of the war
> and it's quite revealing about how little of western Europe Hitler
> was actually interested in. His target was Soviet Russia. He also
> didn't want Italy as an ally, but thanks to some messed up diplomacy
> by the other powers, that's what he got...
>
> ME may only be a game, but one of its founding precepts is neutrals.
> The word neutral carries significant connotations. Maybe they should
> be called "unaligned" instead.
>
> Gavin
>
> On 29 Sep 2005, at 03:10, Steve wrote:
>
>
>> Had Hitler prevailed do you really think he would left a Switzerland
>> alone while he owned most of Europe because he liked them? I
>> don't know why Switzerland was left alone though I do believe
>> that many German officers used it to house what they looted.
>>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------
> ~-->
> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your
> home page
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ofVplB/TM
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> ~->
>
> Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
> To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
> Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.com
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>